unseenguy
08-17 02:40 PM
Please, they do not pull aside every 'Khan' in the world. Yes, things seem OTT every now and then with an amount of drunken patriotism -- and you may come across an occasional "Voldemort" from the INS. However, can you place blame solely on homeland security? We live in a global world / economy of nearly 6 billion and every day visitors with trade of varied kind - surely you cannot expect the avg Joe at homeland security to know every zero talented b'wood hero out there?! I'd also urge you to look at the brighter side of the coin - of the various programs in place to have African Muslims, Arabs and the Iraqis being moved into the US, by giving them jobs, homes and permanent resident status. Likewise with Afghans, and the visa diversity program. These folks have names like Abdul, Osama, Khalid and Khan. So please, tone down the b'wood inspired sensationalism - view things in context.
When you choose to visit America or any foreign nation, national security & well being override celebrity status - period.
Now, I find it interesting, whilst detained at EWR, Shahrook Khan called the Indian Media in 'protest'. Perhaps positive PR for his new movie - 'My name is Khan' that's apparently about racial profiling in America ..hmmm?! Alright, now that is talent. Unethical, perhaps, nevertheless, talent, I think.
I just have to say one thing about you. You were born with a slave mentality in a third country. Its been passed to you from generations. You will go any length to prove your masters are fair and honest and its not your fault. You never experienced free, your own country by your own admission. So stop blabbering and justifying your masters, we dont buy it.
When you choose to visit America or any foreign nation, national security & well being override celebrity status - period.
Now, I find it interesting, whilst detained at EWR, Shahrook Khan called the Indian Media in 'protest'. Perhaps positive PR for his new movie - 'My name is Khan' that's apparently about racial profiling in America ..hmmm?! Alright, now that is talent. Unethical, perhaps, nevertheless, talent, I think.
I just have to say one thing about you. You were born with a slave mentality in a third country. Its been passed to you from generations. You will go any length to prove your masters are fair and honest and its not your fault. You never experienced free, your own country by your own admission. So stop blabbering and justifying your masters, we dont buy it.
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bayarea07
07-22 06:03 PM
Good One !!!
While we are all sharing about our Amway solicitation experiences, let me share what I've seen in the last few years.
Background: In the last 6 years, I've been approached over 2 dozen times in the Bay Area. Things got so bad that the same guys have approached me more than 3 times in some cases before realizing that they've already talked to me before.
Incident #1:
A guy approached me while I was at the mall saying "hi" and striking up a conversation. During our short chat, this 20-something desi guy proceeds to tell me that he is the CIO of Fox News. At which time I pull out my iPhone and look him up using my LinkedIn app under the guise of adding him to my network. Turns out he is an engineer at a local company which he covers up by being embarassed and saying "I haven't updated my profile." I joke about how he moved up in his career so quickly - he then makes an excuse and walks away. I never hear from him again. Another reason to love technology!
Incident #2:
I get approached while shopping at the local GAP store. Being a veteran of this form of solicitation, I respond by saying that I work for the San Jose Mercury News and that we are doing a story on Multi-Level Marketing schemes. I ask him if he knows anyone who would be willing to chat on the record. This guys says "Nope, don't know anyone" and walks away. I never see him again...
Incident #3:
I am at the Nike store and get approached by this guy asking me if I work at Google (I do not). I tell him "Nope" and walk away before he can ask me another question. I have been approached by this same guy 2 more times at other stores (within 6 months) asking me similar questions. The 3rd time, I tell him - "We've spoken before - No, I don't work at Google, No, I'm not from Delhi and No, I'm not interested in what you are selling." He is stunned and walks away with his tail between his legs :)
Incident #4:
The local Fry's is a popular hang out for Amway-types. I learned the hard way because I made my first mistakes here. Both guys that struck up a good conversation with me turned out to be Amway types. After the 2nd phone call, I tell them that if they call me again, I will report them to the authorities and Fry's for illegal solicitation and harassment.
This stops both people in their tracks. I never see them at Fry's again!
Bottom-line: Hold your ground, use technology and don't be afraid to kick them around a little bit. Saying "No" is golden!
While we are all sharing about our Amway solicitation experiences, let me share what I've seen in the last few years.
Background: In the last 6 years, I've been approached over 2 dozen times in the Bay Area. Things got so bad that the same guys have approached me more than 3 times in some cases before realizing that they've already talked to me before.
Incident #1:
A guy approached me while I was at the mall saying "hi" and striking up a conversation. During our short chat, this 20-something desi guy proceeds to tell me that he is the CIO of Fox News. At which time I pull out my iPhone and look him up using my LinkedIn app under the guise of adding him to my network. Turns out he is an engineer at a local company which he covers up by being embarassed and saying "I haven't updated my profile." I joke about how he moved up in his career so quickly - he then makes an excuse and walks away. I never hear from him again. Another reason to love technology!
Incident #2:
I get approached while shopping at the local GAP store. Being a veteran of this form of solicitation, I respond by saying that I work for the San Jose Mercury News and that we are doing a story on Multi-Level Marketing schemes. I ask him if he knows anyone who would be willing to chat on the record. This guys says "Nope, don't know anyone" and walks away. I never see him again...
Incident #3:
I am at the Nike store and get approached by this guy asking me if I work at Google (I do not). I tell him "Nope" and walk away before he can ask me another question. I have been approached by this same guy 2 more times at other stores (within 6 months) asking me similar questions. The 3rd time, I tell him - "We've spoken before - No, I don't work at Google, No, I'm not from Delhi and No, I'm not interested in what you are selling." He is stunned and walks away with his tail between his legs :)
Incident #4:
The local Fry's is a popular hang out for Amway-types. I learned the hard way because I made my first mistakes here. Both guys that struck up a good conversation with me turned out to be Amway types. After the 2nd phone call, I tell them that if they call me again, I will report them to the authorities and Fry's for illegal solicitation and harassment.
This stops both people in their tracks. I never see them at Fry's again!
Bottom-line: Hold your ground, use technology and don't be afraid to kick them around a little bit. Saying "No" is golden!
admin
12-31 07:22 PM
Very good find logiclife. Hope we can get such good points across to our legislators.
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vedicman
01-14 08:46 AM
I don't see anything wrong PlainSpeak's suggestion but I can't comment on if her suggestion is workable or not. But we can just explain what is right or wrong instead of getting into fight mode.
How is misleading members not wrong? Check willigetgc's response
It would be great place to share ideas (good, bad, right, wrong) if those uncivilized response is reduced. The lesser the uncivilized response more the people willing to join hands.
Sharing ideas are good. But if you looked at plainspeak first post he was pretty much goading members to come after him.
There are great people like amitjoey who convey the message in more civilized way (as far as I have seen) and help others (its not easy to post 1100+ posts....). I am new to this country and have very less experience and knowledge to share. But I hope one day I can guide/help some people like amitjoey.
Couldn't agree with you more!
Reason for me to share my thought is amitjoey, otherwise I would have just gone through the thread and felt bad about this forum for uncivilized comments. I am not into any group yet (Eb2/3) as my comp is not going to sponsor gc as per new policy, so I don't belong to any group (or we can say group who's gc never filed). When I read PlainSpeak's comment I thought she was right and after reading amitjoey's comment I learned another view for this issue. After reading those two comments I understand the issue and why IV took different direction or direction different from PlainSpeak's. But when I continued reading this thread I felt why some educated people with good intentions have bad thoughts and respond to others in uncivilized way. In the whole thread only two comments make's sense to me rest doesn't belong/fit to this forum.
Plainspeak posted his view, few agreed with him, most disagreed - but he (My traditional upbringing does not allow me to think a girl can be so confrontational with strangers - so I will go on considering plainspeak as a man) kept up with his goading responding to each member. I cannot think of anyone with good intentions spending time to respond to comments that are not worthwhile.......
Lets get more new members and be civilized to gain confident which will gain more strength to the forum.
Amen
Let me see if I understand PlainSpeak's language:
1. IV core needs to put a lot of resources to lobby for the DV bill, knowing full well that this bill will go nowhere!
2. Raise a false sense of hope among the EB3 community, again, knowing full well that its going to be dashed - just so that IV gains the trust of EB3 (I am EB3, and they have my trust without your logic!)
3. An exercise to gain trust by misleading!:D
I wonder why IV core did not come up with this brilliant idea ;)
My responses are in blue
My advice to you, this forum gives members a chance to voice their problems and many members help with suggestions and experiences. IV works for relieving our problems - and if their intentions are on our side, we need to help them and not fight amongst us or them. Judge by what the administrators of this org say.
How is misleading members not wrong? Check willigetgc's response
It would be great place to share ideas (good, bad, right, wrong) if those uncivilized response is reduced. The lesser the uncivilized response more the people willing to join hands.
Sharing ideas are good. But if you looked at plainspeak first post he was pretty much goading members to come after him.
There are great people like amitjoey who convey the message in more civilized way (as far as I have seen) and help others (its not easy to post 1100+ posts....). I am new to this country and have very less experience and knowledge to share. But I hope one day I can guide/help some people like amitjoey.
Couldn't agree with you more!
Reason for me to share my thought is amitjoey, otherwise I would have just gone through the thread and felt bad about this forum for uncivilized comments. I am not into any group yet (Eb2/3) as my comp is not going to sponsor gc as per new policy, so I don't belong to any group (or we can say group who's gc never filed). When I read PlainSpeak's comment I thought she was right and after reading amitjoey's comment I learned another view for this issue. After reading those two comments I understand the issue and why IV took different direction or direction different from PlainSpeak's. But when I continued reading this thread I felt why some educated people with good intentions have bad thoughts and respond to others in uncivilized way. In the whole thread only two comments make's sense to me rest doesn't belong/fit to this forum.
Plainspeak posted his view, few agreed with him, most disagreed - but he (My traditional upbringing does not allow me to think a girl can be so confrontational with strangers - so I will go on considering plainspeak as a man) kept up with his goading responding to each member. I cannot think of anyone with good intentions spending time to respond to comments that are not worthwhile.......
Lets get more new members and be civilized to gain confident which will gain more strength to the forum.
Amen
Let me see if I understand PlainSpeak's language:
1. IV core needs to put a lot of resources to lobby for the DV bill, knowing full well that this bill will go nowhere!
2. Raise a false sense of hope among the EB3 community, again, knowing full well that its going to be dashed - just so that IV gains the trust of EB3 (I am EB3, and they have my trust without your logic!)
3. An exercise to gain trust by misleading!:D
I wonder why IV core did not come up with this brilliant idea ;)
My responses are in blue
My advice to you, this forum gives members a chance to voice their problems and many members help with suggestions and experiences. IV works for relieving our problems - and if their intentions are on our side, we need to help them and not fight amongst us or them. Judge by what the administrators of this org say.
more...
unseenguy
06-11 07:59 PM
My intention was not to devalue the merits of the incoming batch of immigrants. As I said, around 20% of the group are truly the best and the brightest. This was the case after the dotcom crash and will most likely be the case going forward. We had the same delays, retrogressions , guaranteed employment verification RFEs etc. Immigrationportal.com used to be the immigrationvoice of the times. I do not see much difference for the techies between what was then and what is going on now in terms of delays. I see 2 dramatic changes though
1. People arent patient enough during these times. You would agree to the amount of venting going on in this site.
2. The incessant dumping of low cost of L1s by the outsourcing companies.
If you think through deeply, the second point is what is causing all the heartburn among the people waiting for their GCs. Believe me. All these extrapolated timelines that scream that getting GC today would take 10 years are all bogus. These headlines were the same then too. I can confidently say that the GC process will move fast within a year's time once the layoffs stop. It is just that can you survive till the govt policies become more rational ? That is where the argument about the best and the brightest come into place. If you are one, you would survive this and you will get your GC within 3 years. Honestly, my ntention was to calm the nerves of those people genuinely talented and waiting for their GCs. If I had missed out on that count, I think I should improve my communication. The arwinian flush was just to highlight that fact.
Makes sense now. Peace.
1. People arent patient enough during these times. You would agree to the amount of venting going on in this site.
2. The incessant dumping of low cost of L1s by the outsourcing companies.
If you think through deeply, the second point is what is causing all the heartburn among the people waiting for their GCs. Believe me. All these extrapolated timelines that scream that getting GC today would take 10 years are all bogus. These headlines were the same then too. I can confidently say that the GC process will move fast within a year's time once the layoffs stop. It is just that can you survive till the govt policies become more rational ? That is where the argument about the best and the brightest come into place. If you are one, you would survive this and you will get your GC within 3 years. Honestly, my ntention was to calm the nerves of those people genuinely talented and waiting for their GCs. If I had missed out on that count, I think I should improve my communication. The arwinian flush was just to highlight that fact.
Makes sense now. Peace.
desighee
07-27 04:03 PM
These guys might meet you and greet you in WMT. Once it happened, the guy's wife met my wife and complimented her that "Ooh you have a sweet little boy!" and that's how the convesation started with my wife and then with me. The guy told me he runs his "ecommerce business". Next day he calls us for tea to discuss "ecommerce business" , I became suspicious and charged him "Are you running Amway?" He said there is nothing wrong in running Amway business and I had a heated argument with him over this as to why he did not tell me earlier.
So thats it - nowadays they have adopted a different strategy!
i was once lured into a feakin quickstar/BWW something like that meeting unknowingly where their "platinum member" or some other looser was visiting.
it was me against all of them -my question was simple-why don't you answer all my questions regarding how this works and just keep telling me to have 'trust' in them!
they told me to have trust in our 'own company' and by its product like toothpaste etc.
Next thing i saw when i visited their restroom was a colgate toothpaste on the restroom sink.. haa..platinum loosers
So thats it - nowadays they have adopted a different strategy!
i was once lured into a feakin quickstar/BWW something like that meeting unknowingly where their "platinum member" or some other looser was visiting.
it was me against all of them -my question was simple-why don't you answer all my questions regarding how this works and just keep telling me to have 'trust' in them!
they told me to have trust in our 'own company' and by its product like toothpaste etc.
Next thing i saw when i visited their restroom was a colgate toothpaste on the restroom sink.. haa..platinum loosers
more...
praveenuppaluri
09-03 11:27 AM
I am not a congress supporter and I am definitely not a YSR fan. He was a very powerful man in AP and look at the way he died.. horrible death. it sure is very sad that 5 people died that way. may their souls rest in peace.
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belmontboy
05-30 01:07 AM
Hiralal aka Zen,
Get a life dude and stop parroting housing campaign in every post of yours. You do not even have $25 in your pocket to contribute but you want to talk about financial power of immigrants.
we are listening to new ideas/suggestions by all members, you don't have to be acrimonious in your response.
Please learn to tolerate others. Everybody deserves a fair chance to be heard.
Get a life dude and stop parroting housing campaign in every post of yours. You do not even have $25 in your pocket to contribute but you want to talk about financial power of immigrants.
we are listening to new ideas/suggestions by all members, you don't have to be acrimonious in your response.
Please learn to tolerate others. Everybody deserves a fair chance to be heard.
more...
Green_Always
08-16 03:52 PM
By taking on this subject we are providing good coverage for SRK and talking negative about US Immigraiton we are making them corrupt we should not put pressure on them ( US Immigration ) let them do there duty.
By putting pressure and talking about all these and getting influence from Obama and all is wrong our Indian govt and policies are corrupt and we are pushing these people there now by doing all these things.
Let us look at our future and Jobs over here. Let SRK resolve his headache himself.
Note -- I am not against SRK, I like him and I am fan of him and have seen his movies multiple times and I have full respect to him.
my 2 cents.
By putting pressure and talking about all these and getting influence from Obama and all is wrong our Indian govt and policies are corrupt and we are pushing these people there now by doing all these things.
Let us look at our future and Jobs over here. Let SRK resolve his headache himself.
Note -- I am not against SRK, I like him and I am fan of him and have seen his movies multiple times and I have full respect to him.
my 2 cents.
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PlainSpeak
01-13 03:38 PM
Plainspeak - From one girl to another - you have a lot of time to kill :) For members who did not get worked up by your post, everyone has had a good laugh! Thanks.
Trying to have a discussion on your points is meaningless (at least to me) as I do not believe in conceit.
BTW, you don't have to respond to my post, as I will not be checking it.
Plainspeak - From one girl to another - you have a lot of time to kill For members who did not get worked up by your post, everyone has had a good laugh! Thanks.
You know from one girl to another if you are trying to be scarcastic please dont because you do not know how to. Just come out and say your piece and if it is appended with abuse (Well whats new with IV members)
Trying to have a discussion on your points is meaningless (at least to me) as I do not believe in conceit.Meaningless.
Did you say the same when the flower campaing was done and let me tell you that one succesfull campaing was after of 100 failures. So for you to decide on my points as meaningless is your right to do so and yes even say it out aloud in the forum (To get some laughs at my expense. I donot mind hey it is a free country). What can i say. An effort is an effort and there is no belitting it. Conceit whaaaaa wheeer wheeenn Ok i will let it slide...............
BTW, you don't have to respond to my post, as I will not be checking it. Oh
but i do because whether you check it or not i wil lreply back becasue here on a forum an answer is a sign of respect
Trying to have a discussion on your points is meaningless (at least to me) as I do not believe in conceit.
BTW, you don't have to respond to my post, as I will not be checking it.
Plainspeak - From one girl to another - you have a lot of time to kill For members who did not get worked up by your post, everyone has had a good laugh! Thanks.
You know from one girl to another if you are trying to be scarcastic please dont because you do not know how to. Just come out and say your piece and if it is appended with abuse (Well whats new with IV members)
Trying to have a discussion on your points is meaningless (at least to me) as I do not believe in conceit.Meaningless.
Did you say the same when the flower campaing was done and let me tell you that one succesfull campaing was after of 100 failures. So for you to decide on my points as meaningless is your right to do so and yes even say it out aloud in the forum (To get some laughs at my expense. I donot mind hey it is a free country). What can i say. An effort is an effort and there is no belitting it. Conceit whaaaaa wheeer wheeenn Ok i will let it slide...............
BTW, you don't have to respond to my post, as I will not be checking it. Oh
but i do because whether you check it or not i wil lreply back becasue here on a forum an answer is a sign of respect
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binadh
07-11 12:50 PM
Same with the Guy you just Bad Mouthed... He said that he Loves = Prem USA. Oh well forget about it. .... YOU ARE ALWAYS RIGHT.
My "Avtar Name" is "BharatPremi" not "BharatVasi" To do "Prem" you do not have to be "vasi":)
My "Avtar Name" is "BharatPremi" not "BharatVasi" To do "Prem" you do not have to be "vasi":)
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delax
07-23 01:47 PM
See this post by Nixstor:
http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/showthread.php?p=254275#post254275
If you ignore the VB predictions in the post, the key thing to note is that USCIS and DOS are in constant touch on a weekly basis after the July 07 fiasco. They know exactly the demand and usage rates.
This leads me to one of the following two conclusions:
Either USCIS has intimated to DOS that it can process only X number of cases in the next two months and visas remaining are more than that which is why DOS pushed the dates forward so that consular posts can also maximize usage OR
The numbers remaining are very large for a variety of reasons (category and FB spill over) and USCIS has agreed to process at least a majority if not all the cases within a certain priority date - probably Jun 2006. Based on that DOS agreed to move the PD to June 2006 after also factoring in the CP usage.
Obviously the latter is better for us - but it could be the former as well.
http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/showthread.php?p=254275#post254275
If you ignore the VB predictions in the post, the key thing to note is that USCIS and DOS are in constant touch on a weekly basis after the July 07 fiasco. They know exactly the demand and usage rates.
This leads me to one of the following two conclusions:
Either USCIS has intimated to DOS that it can process only X number of cases in the next two months and visas remaining are more than that which is why DOS pushed the dates forward so that consular posts can also maximize usage OR
The numbers remaining are very large for a variety of reasons (category and FB spill over) and USCIS has agreed to process at least a majority if not all the cases within a certain priority date - probably Jun 2006. Based on that DOS agreed to move the PD to June 2006 after also factoring in the CP usage.
Obviously the latter is better for us - but it could be the former as well.
more...
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ramus
07-04 11:06 AM
When you send any email, subject of the email matters.. If our subject is something like just immigration then I think they will just send automatic reply..
Let Mecaca work on getting good template/letter that we can use to send it to everybody..
Thanks.
I am sick and tired of cookie cutter responses from lawmakers staff. They have a standard template, that starts off with how concerned they are that the immigration system is broken, and their concern for American companies and workers and H-1b.
Enough of that freaking rubbish....
Lets send them letters, and specifically ask them
a) Do you condemn USCIS/DOS behavior, or do you commend it?
b) Do you sympathise with the plight of the employment based greencard applicants or not?
Finally, say that their response will be posted on online public forums so that it can be shared with other employment based greencard applicants.
Let Mecaca work on getting good template/letter that we can use to send it to everybody..
Thanks.
I am sick and tired of cookie cutter responses from lawmakers staff. They have a standard template, that starts off with how concerned they are that the immigration system is broken, and their concern for American companies and workers and H-1b.
Enough of that freaking rubbish....
Lets send them letters, and specifically ask them
a) Do you condemn USCIS/DOS behavior, or do you commend it?
b) Do you sympathise with the plight of the employment based greencard applicants or not?
Finally, say that their response will be posted on online public forums so that it can be shared with other employment based greencard applicants.
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sc3
07-08 05:22 PM
Is there certain minimum "safe" numbers of days one has to stay with the sponsoring company after getting the EB Green Card.
In my case I have been working with my employer since Sept-2001 (almost 7 years). My GC labor was started in Dec 485 filed in May and GC approved June 24, 2008.
I was in the middle of changing jobs using AC21 just before my GC got approved, hence this urgency. How soon can I join some my new job ?
Thanks for your time.
Hmm... GC labor started in DEC and got approval in June 2008, congratulations buddy. What is your category? EB1? EB2?? EB3??? If EB3, it is quite surprising to see an approval for a "non-current" date.
In my case I have been working with my employer since Sept-2001 (almost 7 years). My GC labor was started in Dec 485 filed in May and GC approved June 24, 2008.
I was in the middle of changing jobs using AC21 just before my GC got approved, hence this urgency. How soon can I join some my new job ?
Thanks for your time.
Hmm... GC labor started in DEC and got approval in June 2008, congratulations buddy. What is your category? EB1? EB2?? EB3??? If EB3, it is quite surprising to see an approval for a "non-current" date.
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lazycis
02-13 12:26 PM
The problem here not every country gets equal or equitable piece of pie. The probelm is Part of the pie gets thrown out and not given to people in the line because too many of them happen to be from one country.
How about facts? In 2006, Philippines received 23,733 EB visas, India - 17,169. No other country received more. China received 9,484.
http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/statistics/yearbook/2006/table10d.xls
How about facts? In 2006, Philippines received 23,733 EB visas, India - 17,169. No other country received more. China received 9,484.
http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/statistics/yearbook/2006/table10d.xls
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dealsnet
09-04 05:26 PM
Now I think new people are running IV.
Aman Kapoor (Walden Pond) is not controlling now. That is the reason these idiots have got the admin previlages. Now they do nothing worthwhile. Bunch of jockers.
If this was about you being having admin previledges,you wud have been taken to trial for misusing this board.....AH...
Aman Kapoor (Walden Pond) is not controlling now. That is the reason these idiots have got the admin previlages. Now they do nothing worthwhile. Bunch of jockers.
If this was about you being having admin previledges,you wud have been taken to trial for misusing this board.....AH...
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smuggymba
07-26 07:15 PM
I am not with Amway or Quixtar but I think the folks with Amway/Quixtar are under represented on this thread and it's not fair :-)
Just to add another dimention to this thread I will play the devil's advocate :D
Here I go ...
You guys are all wasting your free time bitching on this thread where as we are spending all our free time growing our business. We will retire early as we would make $xxxx/month for nothing when we turn 40 and dont need to work anymore where as all you guys bitching about Amway / Quixtar will still be working hard at your jobs till 60.
What's your response ?
:D:D:D:D
Anyone can make money in a ponzi scheme..quixtar people just stalk and talk to strangers and ask for their phone number.
Respect other people. Sorry if this offends you.
Just to add another dimention to this thread I will play the devil's advocate :D
Here I go ...
You guys are all wasting your free time bitching on this thread where as we are spending all our free time growing our business. We will retire early as we would make $xxxx/month for nothing when we turn 40 and dont need to work anymore where as all you guys bitching about Amway / Quixtar will still be working hard at your jobs till 60.
What's your response ?
:D:D:D:D
Anyone can make money in a ponzi scheme..quixtar people just stalk and talk to strangers and ask for their phone number.
Respect other people. Sorry if this offends you.
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franklin
02-14 06:51 PM
Question - where are all the numbers for historical visa allocation coming from?
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whoever
02-15 11:37 AM
hey anyone know why since democrats have taken control of house, senate, they havent uttered a word on immigration? last year there was so much noise on tv regarding immigration but none at all this year. i wonder what is going on.
sankap
07-12 11:14 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/27/washington/27points.html?ex=1184385600&en=d3301beecf778d15&ei=5070
June 27, 2007
Canada�s Policy on Immigrants Brings Backlog
By CHRISTOPHER MASON and JULIA PRESTON
TORONTO, June 26 � With an advanced degree in business management from a university in India and impeccable English, Salman Kureishy is precisely the type of foreigner that Canada�s merit-based immigration system was designed to attract.
Yet eight years went by from the time Mr. Kureishy passed his first Canadian immigration test until he moved from India to Canada. Then he had to endure nine months of bureaucratic delays before landing a job in his field in March.
Mr. Kureishy�s experience � and that of Canada�s immigration system � offers a cautionary tale for the United States. Mr. Kureishy came to this country under a system Canada pioneered in the 1960s that favors highly skilled foreigners, by assigning points for education and work experience and accepting those who earn high scores.
A similar point system for the United States is proposed in the immigration bill that bounced back to life on Tuesday, when the Senate reversed a previous stand and brought the bill back to the floor. The vote did not guarantee passage of the bill, which calls for the biggest changes in immigration law in more than 20 years.
The point system has helped Canada compete with the United States and other Western powers for highly educated workers, the most coveted immigrants in high-tech and other cutting-edge industries. But in recent years, immigration lawyers and labor market analysts say, the Canadian system has become an immovable beast, with a backlog of more than 800,000 applications and waits of four years or more.
The system�s bias toward the educated has left some industries crying out for skilled blue-collar workers, especially in western Canada where Alberta�s busy oil fields have generated an economic boom. Studies by the Alberta government show the province could be short by as many as 100,000 workers over the next decade.
In response, some Canadian employers are sidestepping the point system and relying instead on a program initiated in 1998 that allows provincial governments to hand-pick some immigrant workers, and on temporary foreign-worker permits.
�The points system is so inflexible,� said Herman Van Reekum, an immigration consultant in Calgary who helps Alberta employers find workers. �We need low-skill workers and trades workers here, and those people have no hope under the points system.�
Canada accepts about 250,000 immigrants each year, more than doubling the per-capita rate of immigration in the United States, census figures from both countries show. Nearly two-thirds of Canada�s population growth comes from immigrants, according to the 2006 census, compared with the United States, where about 43 percent of the population growth comes from immigration. Approximately half of Canada�s immigrants come through the point system.
Under Canada�s system, 67 points on a 100-point test is a passing score. In addition to education and work experience, aspiring immigrants earn high points for their command of languages and for being between 21 and 49 years old. In the United States, the Senate bill would grant higher points for advanced education, English proficiency and skills in technology and other fields that are in demand. Lower points would be given for the family ties that have been the basic stepping stones of the American immigration system for four decades.
Part of the backlog in Canada can be traced to a provision in the Canadian system that allows highly skilled foreigners to apply to immigrate even if they do not have a job offer. Similarly, the Senate bill would not require merit system applicants to have job offers in the United States, although it would grant additional points to those who do.
Without an employment requirement, Canada has been deluged with applications. In testimony in May before an immigration subcommittee of the United States House of Representatives, Howard Greenberg, an immigration lawyer in Toronto, compared the Canadian system to a bathtub with an open faucet and a clogged drain. �It is not surprising that Canada�s bathtub is overflowing,� Mr. Greenberg said.
Since applications are not screened first by employers, the government bears the burden and cost of assessing them. The system is often slow to evaluate the foreign education credentials and work experience of new immigrants and to direct them toward employers who need their skills, said Jeffrey Reitz, professor of immigration studies at the University of Toronto.
The problem has been acute in regulated professions like medicine, where a professional organization, the Medical Council of Canada, reviews foreign credentials of new immigrants. The group has had difficulty assessing how a degree earned in China or India stacks up against a similar degree from a university in Canada or the United States. Frustrated by delays, some doctors and other highly trained immigrants take jobs outside their fields just to make ends meet.
The sheer size of the Canadian point system, the complexity of its rules and its backlogs make it slow to adjust to shifts in the labor market, like the oil boom in Alberta.
�I am a university professor, and I can barely figure out the points system,� said Don J. DeVoretz, an economics professor at Simon Fraser University in British Columbia who studies immigration systems. �Lawyers have books that are three feet thick explaining the system.�
The rush to develop the oil fields in northern Alberta has attracted oil companies from around the world, unleashing a surge of construction. Contractors say that often the only thing holding them back is a shortage of qualified workers.
Scott Burns, president of Burnco Rock Products in Calgary, a construction materials company with about 1,000 employees, said he had been able to meet his labor needs only by using temporary work permits. Mr. Burns hired 39 Filipinos for jobs in his concrete plants and plans to hire more. He said that many of the temporary workers had critically needed skills, but that they had no hope of immigrating permanently under the federal point system.
�The system is very much broken,� Mr. Burns said.
Mr. Kureishy, the immigrant from India, said he was drawn to Canada late in his career by its open society and what appeared to be strong interest in his professional abilities. But even though he waited eight years to immigrate, the equivalent of a doctoral degree in human resources development that he earned from Xavier Labor Relations Institute in India was not evaluated in Canada until he arrived here. During his first six months, Canadian employers had no formal comparison of his credentials to guide them.
Eventually, Mr. Kureishy, 55, found full-time work in his field, as a program manager assisting foreign professionals at Ryerson University in Toronto. �It was a long process, but I look at myself as fairly resilient,� Mr. Kureishy said.
He criticized Canada as providing little support to immigrants after they arrived.
�If you advertised for professors and one comes over and is driving a taxi,� he said, �that�s a problem.�
Christopher Mason reported from Toronto, and Julia Preston from New York.
June 27, 2007
Canada�s Policy on Immigrants Brings Backlog
By CHRISTOPHER MASON and JULIA PRESTON
TORONTO, June 26 � With an advanced degree in business management from a university in India and impeccable English, Salman Kureishy is precisely the type of foreigner that Canada�s merit-based immigration system was designed to attract.
Yet eight years went by from the time Mr. Kureishy passed his first Canadian immigration test until he moved from India to Canada. Then he had to endure nine months of bureaucratic delays before landing a job in his field in March.
Mr. Kureishy�s experience � and that of Canada�s immigration system � offers a cautionary tale for the United States. Mr. Kureishy came to this country under a system Canada pioneered in the 1960s that favors highly skilled foreigners, by assigning points for education and work experience and accepting those who earn high scores.
A similar point system for the United States is proposed in the immigration bill that bounced back to life on Tuesday, when the Senate reversed a previous stand and brought the bill back to the floor. The vote did not guarantee passage of the bill, which calls for the biggest changes in immigration law in more than 20 years.
The point system has helped Canada compete with the United States and other Western powers for highly educated workers, the most coveted immigrants in high-tech and other cutting-edge industries. But in recent years, immigration lawyers and labor market analysts say, the Canadian system has become an immovable beast, with a backlog of more than 800,000 applications and waits of four years or more.
The system�s bias toward the educated has left some industries crying out for skilled blue-collar workers, especially in western Canada where Alberta�s busy oil fields have generated an economic boom. Studies by the Alberta government show the province could be short by as many as 100,000 workers over the next decade.
In response, some Canadian employers are sidestepping the point system and relying instead on a program initiated in 1998 that allows provincial governments to hand-pick some immigrant workers, and on temporary foreign-worker permits.
�The points system is so inflexible,� said Herman Van Reekum, an immigration consultant in Calgary who helps Alberta employers find workers. �We need low-skill workers and trades workers here, and those people have no hope under the points system.�
Canada accepts about 250,000 immigrants each year, more than doubling the per-capita rate of immigration in the United States, census figures from both countries show. Nearly two-thirds of Canada�s population growth comes from immigrants, according to the 2006 census, compared with the United States, where about 43 percent of the population growth comes from immigration. Approximately half of Canada�s immigrants come through the point system.
Under Canada�s system, 67 points on a 100-point test is a passing score. In addition to education and work experience, aspiring immigrants earn high points for their command of languages and for being between 21 and 49 years old. In the United States, the Senate bill would grant higher points for advanced education, English proficiency and skills in technology and other fields that are in demand. Lower points would be given for the family ties that have been the basic stepping stones of the American immigration system for four decades.
Part of the backlog in Canada can be traced to a provision in the Canadian system that allows highly skilled foreigners to apply to immigrate even if they do not have a job offer. Similarly, the Senate bill would not require merit system applicants to have job offers in the United States, although it would grant additional points to those who do.
Without an employment requirement, Canada has been deluged with applications. In testimony in May before an immigration subcommittee of the United States House of Representatives, Howard Greenberg, an immigration lawyer in Toronto, compared the Canadian system to a bathtub with an open faucet and a clogged drain. �It is not surprising that Canada�s bathtub is overflowing,� Mr. Greenberg said.
Since applications are not screened first by employers, the government bears the burden and cost of assessing them. The system is often slow to evaluate the foreign education credentials and work experience of new immigrants and to direct them toward employers who need their skills, said Jeffrey Reitz, professor of immigration studies at the University of Toronto.
The problem has been acute in regulated professions like medicine, where a professional organization, the Medical Council of Canada, reviews foreign credentials of new immigrants. The group has had difficulty assessing how a degree earned in China or India stacks up against a similar degree from a university in Canada or the United States. Frustrated by delays, some doctors and other highly trained immigrants take jobs outside their fields just to make ends meet.
The sheer size of the Canadian point system, the complexity of its rules and its backlogs make it slow to adjust to shifts in the labor market, like the oil boom in Alberta.
�I am a university professor, and I can barely figure out the points system,� said Don J. DeVoretz, an economics professor at Simon Fraser University in British Columbia who studies immigration systems. �Lawyers have books that are three feet thick explaining the system.�
The rush to develop the oil fields in northern Alberta has attracted oil companies from around the world, unleashing a surge of construction. Contractors say that often the only thing holding them back is a shortage of qualified workers.
Scott Burns, president of Burnco Rock Products in Calgary, a construction materials company with about 1,000 employees, said he had been able to meet his labor needs only by using temporary work permits. Mr. Burns hired 39 Filipinos for jobs in his concrete plants and plans to hire more. He said that many of the temporary workers had critically needed skills, but that they had no hope of immigrating permanently under the federal point system.
�The system is very much broken,� Mr. Burns said.
Mr. Kureishy, the immigrant from India, said he was drawn to Canada late in his career by its open society and what appeared to be strong interest in his professional abilities. But even though he waited eight years to immigrate, the equivalent of a doctoral degree in human resources development that he earned from Xavier Labor Relations Institute in India was not evaluated in Canada until he arrived here. During his first six months, Canadian employers had no formal comparison of his credentials to guide them.
Eventually, Mr. Kureishy, 55, found full-time work in his field, as a program manager assisting foreign professionals at Ryerson University in Toronto. �It was a long process, but I look at myself as fairly resilient,� Mr. Kureishy said.
He criticized Canada as providing little support to immigrants after they arrived.
�If you advertised for professors and one comes over and is driving a taxi,� he said, �that�s a problem.�
Christopher Mason reported from Toronto, and Julia Preston from New York.
breddy2000
09-04 12:57 PM
Sreedhar,
I agree with your comments.
In India, politics have been used to amass money, wealth and YSR has used his position for killings, land grabbing, scams etc.,
Make money the right way, no one stops any one. Where is the end to corrupt means? Yesterday YSR, today his Son. The biggest problem today India is facing is, people involved in policy making deeply submerged in corruption.
There should not be an excuse on comparison. If today we don�t condemn, tomorrow we will be affected. And being here we have to set an example to other people out there in India, living and working in USA is an experience that can�t be valued on paper.
True Facts have Guts to reveal yourself..... We know that you have compromised on personal details about IV members....This is insane I say.....
I agree with your comments.
In India, politics have been used to amass money, wealth and YSR has used his position for killings, land grabbing, scams etc.,
Make money the right way, no one stops any one. Where is the end to corrupt means? Yesterday YSR, today his Son. The biggest problem today India is facing is, people involved in policy making deeply submerged in corruption.
There should not be an excuse on comparison. If today we don�t condemn, tomorrow we will be affected. And being here we have to set an example to other people out there in India, living and working in USA is an experience that can�t be valued on paper.
True Facts have Guts to reveal yourself..... We know that you have compromised on personal details about IV members....This is insane I say.....
